WhyNot?

Multi Fuel IC Engines

Category: Fuel
Responses: 6 (3 in support, 1 neutral, 2 in opposition)
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Multiple Fuel Internal Combustion engines

I've been wondering why in the 21st century I have to be limited to burning only one type of fuel (diesel) in my car using a design which is around one hundred years old?

If the engine had the ability to burn multiple fuels I could take advantage of price differentials. For instance if gasoline was cheaper than diesel in a particular time period I could fill up with and use that , if LPG (Liquid Petroleum Gas) was cheaper than either of those the following week I could fill up with and use that, If bio-diesel or hydrogen were cheaper then I could use those.

I have seen cars which run on gasoline (petrol) continue running after the ignition has been switched off (this is known as 'dieseling') the gasoline is burning by compression not by spark ignition; so what if you made fuel tanks which were easily detatchable by the owner (not by thieves) and an engine which could switch between spark and compression ignition depending on what type of fuel the management computer detected in the tank which was currently attatched to the vehicle?

What if you could put three or four of these modular fuel tanks on your car each with a different type of fuel in them and when you entered the car a GUI interface would say .

You have the following fuels available for use today

1. Gasoline

2. Hydrogen Gas

3. LPG

4. Bio Diesel

What ratio would you like to use them in?

You could program it to burn each fuel in proportion to the cost say as an example

50% Bio Diesel, 15% Gasoline, 25% LPG, 10% regular diesel

So for 50% of the engine cycle you would inject bio-diesel/air mix into the cylinders and use compression ignition

for 15% of the engine cycle you would inject gasoline/air mixture into the cylinders and use electric spark ignition

for 25% of the engine cycle you would inject LPG/air mixture into the cylinders and use electric spark ignition

for 10% of the engine cycle you would inject regular diesel air mixture into the cylinders and use compression ignition.

What if you could burn a different fuel in each cylinder simultaneously

1st cylinder would burn gasoline/air mixture with spark ignition

2nd cylinder would burn biodiesel/air mixture with compression ignition

3rd cylinder would burn LPG/air mixture with spark ignition

4th cylinder would burn regular diesel with compresion ignition

This would need some fancy engine management software but I think with a bit of research effort it could be done. You would need to be careful to inject the right amounts of each different fuel to produce the same amounts of energy in each cylinder otherwise the engine would run roughly and wear out quickly. But all you would really need would be the ability to switch between spark and compression ignition depending on what was being squirted into the cylinders at any particular time and some extra pumps,fuel lines, injectors and valves.Would the residues from different fuels react in the cylinders. Do the different fuels need different compression ratios?

hanfgeist, Nov 06 2005

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I have only a general understanding of engines but I think a diesel has a much larger compression ratio than a gasoline engine.

sand, Nov 07 2005

Multi-fuel engines do exist and have existed for quite some time, though I do not know much about them. The military often uses them in vehicles, but I believe the advantage lies in battlefield convenience more so than engergy efficiency. I think you get a more efficient engine with a highly refined design for a single fuel (design refined for the task, commuter vehicle vs. cargo truck), coupled with conservative driving habits, than with the ability to buy and burn whatever fuel is cheapest at the moment.

Good thinking though.

serotina, Dec 06 2005

Flexible fuel engines also exist. They can be designed as gasoline/natural gas hybrids or gasoline/ethanol hybrids. Also, gasoline/electric hybrids and diesel/electric hybrids that can be plugged into the power grid effectively run on whatever is being used to produce the current marginal electricity production. In southern California, I believe this is natural gas. Biodiesel and diesel fuel can both run in a diesel engine. I believe the only modification necessary is to preheat the incoming fuel a little bit to compensate for biodiesel's cold-weather performance. Specially modified diesel vehicles can run straight vegetable oil (SVO) or waste vegetable oil (WVO), but I am not sure what the modifications are that allow this. More information is available at the biodiesel web sites. I don't think any of these engines run two fuels simultaneously, but they can be capable of switching fuels on the fly, which I think is just as useful.

johncalusa, Dec 06 2005

Like what others have said, flexible fuel vehicles can be made. However, doing so saps efficiency. Much of your savings can be lost if, for example a gasoline only engine gets 30mpg, while the flex vehicle that can also burn diesel only gets 23mpg. Ethanol/Gasoline is close enough that only timing has to be changed between, however, a car designed solely for the ultra-high octane fuel that is ethanhol would be more efficient at burning it than one that can also burn regular.

Firethorn, Jan 05 2006

I see what you are saying about the benefits of being able to switch fuels, and I'm all for it. But the idea of having each cylinder running a different fuel is a bit convoluted. That would definatly be a product of overengineering, and way to complex to deliver any savings on the ablity to use your choice of fuels.

JM, Sep 13 2006

I don't think it would be possible to make a diesel engine work with gasoline because the high compression would cause the gasoline to explode upon injection (which is very very very bad for an engine).

mgardner, Nov 25 2006

I like what your saying. The idea of having flexability in fuel is a good idea. The most efficent form of fuel would be hydrogen as all fuel is based on its content. In which case water can be used as fuel. Once broke down you could use the hydrogen from it to run your vehicle regardless the type of ICE you have. Specific inventor would be Stan Meyers who designed the Water Fuel Cell (WFC). that could be hooked up to almost any vehicle and run. Although he was assasinated he made many patents that can be found free by searching them on the web even videos on youtube.com. I am currently trying to reproduce his invention. I plan to assemble it over the summer and install it on my old beater to test it out. There are many designs based on what he has done which can be duplicated. I suggest that you check them out and see for yourself. It all is based on the idea as hydrogen as a fuel.

gdog, May 02 2007

I didnt realise that Stan Meyers had been assassinated.Maybe his idea works and the oil companies decided to take him out. I think water vapour is also a greenhouse gas which is what is produced when you burn hydrogen in an internal combustion engine so they may have to add that in to their climate change model if people start using it in their cars. I just made my first batch of home brew biodiesel and it seems to work ok in my car though it's not cost effective to make in small quantities as they charge a lot for small bottles of the methanol that you need to make it. Cost comes way down if you buy a large drum of methanol and get some used oil from a restaurant. I read recently that they are working on a device which makes fuel by converting the CO2 in the atmosphere back into hydrocarbons.

hanfgeist, May 03 2007

Stan Meyers alleged that he was offered a "billion dollars" for his "water cell;" this is the true inventor's dream. That's far more money than he could ever have made had he marketed his invention. There are two possibilities:

1.) It didn't work, or

2.) there was never any "billion dollar offer."

He wasn't assassinated, he suffered a cerebral thrombosis after eating a meal at a restaurant.

Beaugrand, Dec 06 2007