WhyNot?

perpetual motion does exist

Category: Environment
Responses: 7 (2 in support, 0 neutral, 5 in opposition)
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perpetual motion does exist and i can prove it here are some examples

1.moon orbiting earth is perpetual

2.I'm not to sure if this true but while reading a survival book it said you could buy a crystal the provided light that was just enough to read a map by

3.i found this comment on a different article on this site and thought i would include it There is a way to turn matter into energy, Einstein discovered it. It works according to the formular E=MC2. I would not recommend trying that in your living room, there are plenty of places where it's been done already, Sellafield, Hartlepool, Hiroshima, Chernobyl

your comments would be very helpful thanks

energydude, Dec 11 2006

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Comments from other members:

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I commend your adventurous spirit and advise you to look a bit more deeply into your theories. First, the Moon is changing its orbit very slowly and eventually will be destroyed. Your crystal may give off light but not perpetually if it releases energy. That energy is not infinite and eventually the light will go out. The Sun and stars produce their energy through atomic reaction and that too, eventually ceases and stars go out, sometimes with violent reactions.

sand, Dec 11 2006

You are deeply confused as to what "perpetual motion" means. Perpetual motion is one of two things: motion that continues on infinitely with no energy input, or a generator that produces more energy than it consumes.

There are many cosmological and geological events that appear "perpetual," but they just last a very long time compared to the length of time humans have been around for. Many dead stars are so hot and so massive they will not cool off until far beyond the universe is predicted to end. Perpetual? Nope.

To be fair, a nuclear fission and fusion don't turn matter into energy. They release the energy of the bonds holding atoms together, much like a fire is releasing the energy stored in chemical bonds. And still, this is not perpetual energy. It's abundant, yes. But it is not infinite. Mass is not infinite, either.

toastydeath, Dec 12 2006

The moon is not perpetual lol

quantum fluctuations in energy could be magnified to prevent the cooling trends (therefore perpetual motion is achieved), but this would violate both the 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics. Creating a machine to do would require a massive ammount of energy and could possible destroy the universe.

Hi, Dec 12 2006

i found the book today on number 2 it is actually called a beta light and the book said they were everlasting but expensive??

energydude, Dec 13 2006

Beta lights are filled with a phosphore and a radioactive gas. The radioactive gas causes the phosphore to glow as it emits radiation.

While it might last a long time it is not perpetual.

Hyenuf, Dec 13 2006

Toastydeath, by your first definition "motion that continues on infinitely with no energy input," perpetual motion does exist, at least theoretically. According to Newton's 1st Law of Motion, an object in motion will stay in motion indefinitely unless acted upon by a force. Of course, when people say "perpetual motion," they are normally refering to your second definition. Obviously the original poster was confusing these two definitions. I think you no doubt knew all this, but you didn't explain it well in your comment.

Dwane Anderson, Jan 09 2007

You're a moron of unspeakable proportions.

EmeraldFalcon, Feb 28 2007

1. The Moon and Earth exist in a frictionless environment, and therefore are doing no actual work in thier orbit. Extract any work whatsoever from the orbit of the Moon around the Earth, and the orbit will decay.

2. This crystal is getting its energy from somewhere, and it will not last forever. Either: 1> its energy is stored into it when it is in sunlight, like most glow-in-the-dark objects, only to be released when in the dark, or 2> its some sort of chemical reaction, in which the chemicals will eventually be depleted or bonded, or otherwise used up.

3. Nuclear fusion is what you're referring to here. In fusion and fission, tremendous amounts of energy are released to be sure - but not infinite. Eventually all of the atoms in the nuclear fuel are converted into a state where they cannot be fused or split any more. This is what will eventually happen to all stars: the matter that makes up the start will be fused again and again, making ever more exotic materials, until all of it is converted into a material that cannot be fused.

ericcox, Mar 28 2007

ericcox: The Moon is continuously doing work, and the Moons orbit is decaying presently at a rate of about 1 1/2 inches per year. The gravity interactions between any two objects imparts forces on one another and if any energy is released due to that work the energies must be conserved. Therefore the Moon influencing the tides of the Earth must be reflected in the centripetal force and or the movement of matter on the Moon. Due to the relatively weak forces matter moves slightly and produces heat, but the greater observable influence will be related to centripetal energies.

Which is why perpetual motion machines must produce energy to compensate for the frictional losses of matter interacting with matter through gravity.

Do I think a "Virtual" Perpetual Motion Machine is possible. Virtual as in for practical applications! Sure. The Sun has powered life on Earth for millions of years. For all of the lifetimes of all species that have lived and died within that time frame, the Sun was "Virtually" perpetual.

What happens to a photon traveling out into the expanse of space? Does it's flight terminate? Long after the Universe disassociates (current accepted theory where all matter evolves into lesser energy states and half lives of all elements eventually form matter-less energies), will all energies continue to propogate devoid of matter type interactions? Is the propagation of light perpetual or does it have limits?


Related to the theory of disassociation of matter being the final state of the Universe, though it is currently accepted, I have a different theory related to the influences of graviton. But graviton are currently only a suspected phenomena and can not be proven at this time.

We have learned a great deal in the life times of two people; 1776 until now. Hopefully, we will use what we learn to care for and maintain our planet long enough for us to learn how to be born intelligent, rather than having to learn those qualities for ourselves. Too many people attribute absolute knowledge to other people, rather than using their own minds.


umm not to be too "outside the box" here, but aren't blackholes perpetual motion "machines" - as far as we know? I don't think I've ever heard of a blackhole running out, and surely the energy they release exceeds in the input. I guess this is where physics and quantum don't go together so well.

sdmac21, Apr 22 2008